Total War: WARHAMMER III

Total War: WARHAMMER III

Wegh - An Overhaul / Pile of Stuff [BETA]
 This topic has been pinned, so it's probably important
Lorghul  [developer] 13 May @ 11:35am
Extra combat balance notes
Important reminder - combat changes don't work properly in custom battles.

Combat is designed to be about x2 longer than vanilla balance, so about 10 minutes on average for a battle to wrap up. Units deal way less than half damage however, the cause for battles ending is increased morale panic. You can cause chain routs by getting a couple units to shatter at the same time. Focus on one flank with your strongest units to batter them, hit them with ranged, spells and rear charges (all of them each apply a different morale penalty) to cause a rout. Don't spread your damage out evenly. If you don't successfully chain rout the enemy and try to individually kill each unit battles will last much longer. Battle length can vary a lot depending on what you're fighting though, stacks of chaff will rout even faster than vanilla while elite armies can hold the line far longer.

In vanilla, ranged units have very good accuracy by default, so much so that buffs to accuracy aren't really noticeable. You can have a unit of rank 1 peasant archers firing on a single foot lord in combat and each arrow will perfectly arc through the air and land directly on the head of that lord. Accuracy is much lower in this mod so rank 1 units will have trouble hitting an entire unit at distance. With lower rank units try firing into large melees where they will have trouble missing anything, don't get into max-range archery duels against another single ranged unit (unless that unit equally sucks and you feel like wasting ammo).

Elite cav is rebalanced to be the most powerful thing on the battlefield compared to infantry or ranged, but charge speed drops dramatically as a unit gets exhausted so it doesn't last. Cavalry is harder to use than passively sitting back with infantry and ranged, gets an entire unit classification (spearmen) designed just to hard-counter it, and is less effective in sieges. The reward for bringing elite cavalry is that it's more effective when used properly.

Towers hit much harder and also apply a strong slow to units they hit. Siege towers hard counter them. If you run in with ass ladders without using artillery to destroy their defenses first you will suffer heavy casualties.

Some other random notes:
* Undead rely on their wizard characters to remain intact. Kill the wizard to make them fall apart
* Individual cav models have a small chance to rear up and stall when charging into braced spearmen, so... don't do that
* Charge bonus lasts 30 seconds instead of the vanilla 13 seconds, to account for the slower combat
* Gunpowder and warp lightning artillery has a very small chance to misfire and explode. It should not be happening enough to effect balance, it's mostly for flavour. Campaign health for artillery is based on the number of men surviving, not the number of artillery pieces, so misfires won't carry over to campaign
* Necromancers and Ghouls are not undead
* Menace from below don't disintegrate. You're going to need it with Skaven, with the morale problems they have
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Showing 1-15 of 24 comments
Have vortex spells movement been slowed? Or are they still very unreliable as vanilla?
Lorghul  [developer] 28 May @ 6:59am 
Nope, didn't touch them
I noticed the lord of undead passive has no listed effects, is that intentional?
Devolve says it causes damage to combatants, but the damage is not listed
Ive noticed malagor will generate 3 rnd spells from the chosen lore, AND a fourth rnd spell from the other lores. Doesn’t indicate anywhere why he gets that fourth one
Lorghul  [developer] 28 May @ 9:46am 
Originally posted by sarumanthecursed:
I noticed the lord of undead passive has no listed effects, is that intentional?
Thanks for reminding me, I forgot that tooltip was blank for some reason. It gives undead +40 leadership, it counteracts the -40 leadership all undead get. It makes keeping wizards alive important for undead.

Originally posted by sarumanthecursed:
Devolve says it causes damage to combatants, but the damage is not listed
It does that in vanilla too, it's a CA bug. I didn't change it.

Originally posted by sarumanthecursed:
Ive noticed malagor will generate 3 rnd spells from the chosen lore, AND a fourth rnd spell from the other lores. Doesn’t indicate anywhere why he gets that fourth one
I booted up a malagor campaign a couple times and he had 3 spells like he should have, dunno where he got the 4th from. Might be one of his default spells didn't get deactivated properly, I'll just manually disable his default spells to be sure.
Should khalida have the undead lord passive? Lichmasters have it.
Would be neat if skill trees were more unique to race. A tomb prince summoning a bear is a bit odd…. How about a tomb scorpion!

My 2 cents. Still a wonderful system
Lorghul  [developer] 29 May @ 2:08am 
Originally posted by sarumanthecursed:
Should khalida have the undead lord passive? Lichmasters have it.
Undead wizards have the undead lord passive, Khalida starts with a wizard she can use for this purpose. She isn't a wizard though so she doesn't get it. Tomb kings haven't had a proper skill pass yet so their skilltree is generic, which is especially egregious for them considering they're a very unique race. I'll do them next.
Overall, I think large units need a buff in this mod. At least trolls as they seem to do no damage By the AI.
The cockatrice really struggles to get out an attack animation when surrounded by halberds, looks pretty weird.
Also the changeling doesn’t seem to use his shapeshifter ability in battle
The battle ai for the undead really seem to struggle getting kills with the new leadership and combat mechanics. I would recommend increasing the attack interval to like 1-2 seconds, the ai tends to get more even footing in kills for some reason. Also crypt horrors struggle to get attacks out vs infantry, when surrounded, looks pretty janky
Lorghul  [developer] 3 Jun @ 3:53pm 
I'm not sure what's causing the reported problems with monsters/monstrous infantry. In terms of performance I just tested the Changeling's first battle with and without this mod enabled, just unga-bungaing my army into Niedling's garrison and seeing what happens. I let the Cockatrice solo a unit of spearmen and record it's performance.

With this mod enabled it did 2000 damage and got about 2 kills and then routed. Without the mod it got about 2000 damage and 20 kills and then routed. This is what I'd expect. It's doing the appropriate damage, but not getting as many kills because it knocks models away who are now out of attack range and the Cockatrice instead attacks the nearby (full health) models, compared to vanilla where it 1 shots spearmen. That's a consequence of lowering combat speed. It makes monsters like that slightly worse because they take longer to get their kills (and falsely give the impression that they're way worse until they get those kills), but monsters are also much better against lords and heroes in this mod because characters get their health nerfed but units do not. Swings and roundabouts.

The cockatrice attack animation problem - I noticed it kinda stutter about when it got into combat, stuttering from left to right without attacking before it decided it didn't like being stabbed. It did this both with and without the mod enabled. Probably easier to notice with the mod enabled though cause you've got more time to zoom in and watch units fighting.

Attack interval is already lowered to 2 seconds in this mod btw
That makes a lot of sense now that you explained it in simple terms for us haha.

Wonder if anything can be done in terms of their “making up their mind - stuttering” issue.
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