Space Engineers

Space Engineers

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Real Hydrogen rebalanced + Hydrogen Fusion
   
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Type: Mod
Mod category: Block, Production, Other
Tags: NoScripts
File Size
Posted
Updated
2.402 MB
8 Feb, 2022 @ 9:22am
14 Jul, 2022 @ 5:58pm
7 Change Notes ( view )
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Real Hydrogen rebalanced + Hydrogen Fusion

In 1 collection by REV4666
Rev4666's collection
55 items
Description
Real Hydrogen rebalanced + Hydrogen Fusion (more or less)

if you want only the ice refinery and hydrogen fusion reactors without the rebalance you can go at this Mod:
https://steamproxy.net/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2748190802

For some reason, the Hydrogen fusion reactors+ Mod has been banned, I have tried to contact steam about it and try to clarify and I am waiting on them to respond to me so I can try and fix the situation.



I heard a lot of people (me included) say the Hydrogen in vanilla break the law of thermodynamics so I did a little googling and this is what I found:

The Efficiency of generating electricity from hydrogen should be around 67% to 86% of the energy you needed to create the hydrogen from water (or in this case ice)

In vanilla, a hydrogen engine generates about 8 times the energy needed for the O2H2 generator to create the same amount of hydrogen. An efficiency of 800%

This mod rebalances the O2/H2 generator and the hydrogen engine so that the laws of thermodynamics are not violated. We assume here the hydrogen engine produces power by means of internal combustion since it looks like one.
Those are the changes I made:
  1. I reduced the amount of Gas produced per KG of ice from 10L of oxygen to 4 and 20L of Hydrogen to 8
    ***** update The regular large grid O2/H2 generator has been reduced to 7L hydrogen Per KG (think of it as a leek in it) *******

  2. I increased the energy required for the O2/H2 generator by 3 (it takes 1.5MWh instead of 0.5 MWh)
  3. I increased the amount of ice it consumes from 25 to 200 that way we don't have to wait so many hours to fill a small tank
  4. I reduced the efficiency of the hydrogen engine by 10 (it now takes 10 times more fuel to produce the same 5MW)
  5. I increase the capacity of its internal fuel tank it is now the same as a regular small tank
After those changes, the efficiency is about 80%. With those changes, hydrogen is more of an energy reserve that can be transferred rapidly to a ship, rover, or tanker like any gasoline.

But doing only that, create another problem.
Now we are missing an important way to produce mid-range power. We have very low to low generating power with solar panels, low-end mid-power with the wind turbine, and after that, you go High to very high with nuclear.

And you are S.O.L. if you don’t have wind or uranium on the planet. If you don’t have Wind it takes 63 solar panels to get 5Mw/h and 187 solar panels to get 15Mw/h. Many times, I play with the no uranium anywhere + scarce resources Mods, so that is a scenario that is very frequent for me.

For the Mid-level solution:
In real life, we have many ways to generate steam and create electricity (Ex: Coal, natural gas), or hydropower (and probably others that I forgot at the moment) to fill that gap.
  • Doubling the solar panel power production (and doubling the number of solar cells they need)
  • Increasing the wind capacity of the wind turbine by 50% (also increasing the component needed by 50%)
This Mod also adds 3 blocks for high-level Solution:
And finally, for those like me who play most of the game without uranium
  1. Large grid ice refinery:
  2. Large Grid Hydrogen Fusion reactor
  3. Small grid hydrogen Fusion reactor
The ice refinery is the equivalent of 5 O2H2 generators but takes much more resources to build than 5 regular generators (need superconductors and reactor components)

The Large and small Fusion reactors uses reactor components superconductors and gravity components and are 10 times more efficient than vanilla hydrogen engine and have a max output similar to nuclear reactors. at full power, they will drain your H2 tanks as fast as Large Hydrogen thrusters

Note: The game is very imprecise so if you put a small about of ice at a time you get much better efficiency, I made my test with about 30K Kg - 40K Kg of ice. But when I put only 1k Kg it has much better efficiency of over 90% but still below 100%

IRL Info

A completely efficient electrolysis system would require 39 kWh of electricity to produce 1 kg of hydrogen. However, the devices commonly found in operation for this process are less efficient. A typical operational figure is about 48 kWh per kg of hydrogen

In electrical terms, the energy density of hydrogen is equal to 33.6 kWh of usable energy per kg to produce one kg of H2 you need 9 kg of water


solar panels are overpowered compared to what they could produce in real life. The average intensity of solar energy reaching the top of the atmosphere directly facing the Sun is about 1,360 watts per square meter and the solar panel's size is about 48 square meters. They should produce about a max of 65Kw/h at 100% efficiency, not 160.

Here is what I found for fusion:

The amount of energy produced by fusing 1 kg of hydrogen is 170-gigawatt hours.

From what I understand, this is the energy released when fusion occurs. But a fusion generator needs a lot of energy to create and maintain the pressure and heat needed for the plasma where the fusion can occur. Then you have a lot of energy loss during the transformation from the energy released as heat into electricity

Since we have not achieved a fusion reactor in real life yet. And in the game, we have gravity generators that could help generate the pressure needed, I decided to give even better efficiency than the vanilla engines)

15 Comments
1antonioorlo1 23 Feb, 2023 @ 1:27pm 
I think there is only one way to fix this - rename the HydrogenEngine to HydrogenFusionEngine and adjust it to an efficiency slightly greater than 1
REV4666  [author] 13 Jul, 2022 @ 10:55am 
@1antonioorlo1 if the generator turns on and off. Then it probably means you don't have enough power to run the Generators continually. At one tick they see power so they turn on and generate H2 the other tick they drain the power they have and turn it off and repeat itself.

And I would guess that you put enough generators that just one tick produces more H2 than 1 engine consumes so it fills up.

I never thought of that. But to use this (exploit?) you would have to do 1 of 2 things.
Have a specialized grid that produces H2 and retrieves that H2 with another grid. Or have the grid switch in a mode to generate H2 (turn off everything but the generators and 1 engine) and a second mode that runs things normally.

I like it, and think it's fair play (and I have no idea how I would try to fix that)
1antonioorlo1 9 Jul, 2022 @ 6:10pm 
Hmm
No, you can

If you put 1 Engine and many O2/H2 generators and turn them on, then the engine tank will start to fill up
It can also be seen that the value of electricity consumption fluctuates, and the generators turn on/off very quickly
REV4666  [author] 7 Jul, 2022 @ 6:27am 
@KenshiSaan In simple terms :
I nerfed the electrical power you can get back from Hydrogen. i did not touch the propulsion power of Hydrogen thrusters.

With this mod you can no longer use O2/H2 generator in combination with the hydrogen engine to recharge you'r battery. it will do the reverse You will need another source of energy (solar/ wind/ nuclear) to produce the hydrogen
KenshiSaan 6 Jul, 2022 @ 10:49pm 
i dont understand so you nerf hydrogen ?
REV4666  [author] 19 Jun, 2022 @ 6:53am 
@1antonioorlo1 Just made an update but i didn't want to increase the power required to run the O2H2 Generators more then i already did
So instead i reduced the Hydrogen produced by the large generator to 7 instead of 8 and that seem to do the trick. I imagine there is a leak in that block that is why it's less effective
1antonioorlo1 17 Jun, 2022 @ 6:25am 
Hmmm
I think it is broken, because i can make more H and Energy with only hydrogen motor and H2+O generator (+Ice), Large blocks
So the power efficiency is more than 100% (mb ≈110%)

"OperationalPowerConsumption" can be not 1.5, but 1.6 to make it ≈99,999%
I will choose 1.75 for ≈90%
Maus 20 May, 2022 @ 6:55am 
@REV4666 Thenks!
REV4666  [author] 20 May, 2022 @ 3:30am 
@Maus if you are using regular hydro thrusters to fly it should not change.

If you are using hydrogen a hydro engine to power up atmospheric thrusters (or ions if you are in space) it will last 10 time less because the engine take more hydrogen to produce power.

If you are using Fusion reactors to power up your atmo or ions, at first glance you should last 10 time longer. But since the reactors are a lot heavier you need more thrust to stay in the air. the ratio will depend on how much more weight the reactor bring compared to the rest of the ship/plane
Maus 17 May, 2022 @ 4:01am 
I didn't understand how long it is possible to fly on a full tank of hydrogen now?